From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp12.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id aFesAjIi0WOW5AAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 25 Jan 2023 13:36:02 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp12.migadu.com with LMTPS id gKRgAjIi0WOyWgEAauVa8A (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 25 Jan 2023 13:36:02 +0100 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BEE6F1CE3B for ; Wed, 25 Jan 2023 13:36:01 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pKf01-0002aB-8R; Wed, 25 Jan 2023 07:35:33 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pKezz-0002a2-7c for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Jan 2023 07:35:31 -0500 Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pKezx-00034N-3c for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Jan 2023 07:35:30 -0500 Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 12C7024051E for ; Wed, 25 Jan 2023 13:35:26 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1674650127; bh=+R1U2VKoOTJ/wbOan91sP/tIocHzzAXi2K5DTtsP0Es=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:From; b=sKP/YWMPMNKzqQyON1GGd6CDPmAllIFaXJslf04pEYvEd6CLbHGg6ZKdmimKeujN7 UXHbFPLB3PbYJSPUMte8x8S+qlBpwCRPIFnX5qi83hmQsj8yIdUUY6IhgefjBP7131 Jv5kbvo/FP1At9AciGgRNzcomv6tn30XQHnB/vlrh4y568Fqo7+KgDUbCwFitnYbSD pRx/tkMpjSd9rB0l/xbkOnA894ccBJGY49fyKvhTCw9p1x770ERFsWIYaJDnihtbCy K2mIgZvQwf3KRaa+aRbXQ4oVbUwZu0Np4gETPGD5oGhqrRJrd9h1dIARWewj1ZHt9M 9uaO0lWW5CYTA== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4P23G56bQ7z6tng; Wed, 25 Jan 2023 13:35:25 +0100 (CET) From: Ihor Radchenko To: Tim Cross Cc: rms@gnu.org, Jean Louis , emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: Supporting non-free SQL clients in ob-sql (was: [PATCH] ob-sql: Add support for Athena) In-Reply-To: <63d0e433.170a0220.54a51.4c8f@mx.google.com> References: <874jsqbvfq.fsf@kraus.my> <87358an35i.fsf@localhost> <63c5b8db.170a0220.e466f.2573@mx.google.com> <87o7qxmr6y.fsf@kraus.my> <87fsc9iifs.fsf@localhost> <63d0e433.170a0220.54a51.4c8f@mx.google.com> Date: Wed, 25 Jan 2023 12:35:58 +0000 Message-ID: <87a626n64x.fsf@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=yantar92@posteo.net; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1674650161; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=T5sdbAThYhplg20fEnVlFaCzVJ0iSZq6StNBJs+8/is=; b=hHlqy5fLYFQNeYt6K8zHzcdGCRXVsVdM+eLoBLOj01jU6kiGOixObrGfd+v0uVitN/uIUf bKUvnFOMmIDWCqYFRkM6FrgPdpsL0YLh/RXXGPihwPxTx+v7zthitx6erZGdm2Pp4hWRHS iR3+xp2zX2wOrz9Awqop2A9oTVpYid+87CBIZH9jRLk30nGpCpb2Xb3vo5nLcC1SGxK16j q5J3Og01G4TknrjUSV4BiKsQ2Pu4m6ZEvC93S44XAwcRjFQf6l+Bov3jSE54HxvQyYYM1r cDbrx8aLV1EdrfQaWV8slRDUuCtr93TUyC6/KGc+YH/zA6z2mfZdata6UiPz9Q== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b="sKP/YWMP"; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1674650161; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=cjE0wEUNLyXxDjY+DP+lm/QyVMmRSw9f2EGc8xVV53LhkgyPLp7AXrabXvtHnTZg2oGgFc Kc88qEkhI/noV7XTo0y79NXZ7AEfG9pJCrrP3PIYjtsuT1K3DhHXCCwZGa/zm0JeQiMGbP epDyRDig1K1KR2nKtmm8Mv6XW/WDpet4imzVjL0oZZMTcaFFAspmn8WP3jytCK1vh9f81V EOfYgtNzaWayha0taf/asevUjXKD+UcvTgvbAMJGdNxuLbXmt7Im4ZkJQoviYUs325bG3E Bn+kJhLXeL+5SHBbkwUaiR/XK5qRxPpZezS/X5y1ydg2KhXhm60C+1qPdOUvKA== X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.net header.s=2017 header.b="sKP/YWMP"; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.net X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -6.04 X-Spam-Score: -6.04 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: BEE6F1CE3B X-TUID: qLIXGu/DX/S7 Tim Cross writes: > to be very clear, ob-sql is not adding any NEW interface to any external > program. It is just using the Emacs built-in SQL library (Elisp), which > has been part of Emacs for a long time (I was using it in late 90s to > work with Oracle RDMS). It is this library that provides the 'support' > for things like Oracle's RDMS. If you want more specific information, > ask on emacs-devel. Org mode is just using this built-in library. This is wrong. `org-babel-execute:sql' directly calls the CLI executable via `process-file'. That said, the discussion about sql.el is also relevant wrt non-free SQL client support. It will be helpful to clarify what is morally acceptable for all the scenarios, not just for Org's use-case. > The Oracle database is simply a relational database management system in > the same way as Postgres, MySQL, Ingris, MS-Sql server etc. All of these > have a CLI client and support connections via JDBC. The sql.el library > provides specialised comint based interfaces which run the CLI to > communicate with the RDMS. The closest of your 3 choices is b, as the > build-in Emacs sql library executes the RDMS CLI in a sub-process comint > buffer. Org does not use this comint interface yet. We may in future though, for sessions: (defun org-babel-prep-session:sql (_session _params) "Raise an error because Sql sessions aren't implemented." (error "SQL sessions not yet implemented")) -- Ihor Radchenko // yantar92, Org mode contributor, Learn more about Org mode at . Support Org development at , or support my work at