From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Carsten Dominik Subject: Re: Re: keys and command name info Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2010 09:39:26 +0200 Message-ID: <86490E4E-6B55-4596-82A9-1BDD1079B1F0@uva.nl> References: <4C5086C1.9060000@easy-emacs.de> <20100808222636.GF20223@shi.workgroup> <770A61DC-4063-4A72-95F2-21F4E7DE6E77@gmail.com> <87fwyom8iv.fsf@gmx.net> <20100809101957.GC14007@shi.workgroup> <878w4f4oy4.fsf@stats.ox.ac.uk> <87tyn337rm.fsf@stats.ox.ac.uk> <21306250-E2A2-46A7-BFB5-891034F3FA59@gmail.com> <4C659D63.1090003@easy-emacs.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v936) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Return-path: Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=38403 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OkY5R-00069k-DJ for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 15 Aug 2010 03:57:03 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OkXoe-0007ya-Mo for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 15 Aug 2010 03:39:38 -0400 Received: from paard.ic.uva.nl ([145.18.40.182]:33440) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OkXoe-0007yE-FQ for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 15 Aug 2010 03:39:36 -0400 In-Reply-To: List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org To: Carsten Dominik Cc: emacs-orgmode On Aug 15, 2010, at 9:37 AM, Carsten Dominik wrote: > > On Aug 13, 2010, at 9:30 PM, Andreas R=F6hler wrote: > >> Am 11.08.2010 12:05, schrieb Carsten Dominik: >>> >>> On Aug 9, 2010, at 9:28 PM, Dan Davison wrote: >>> >>>> Dan Davison writes: >>>> >>>>> Gregor Zattler writes: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi Andreas, org-mode developers, >>>>>> * Andreas Burtzlaff [09. Aug. 2010]: >>>>>>> Carsten Dominik writes: >>>>>>>> I have put a version of the manual as modified by Andreas here: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://orgmode.org/org-manual-with-command-names.pdf >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Not all the command names are in there, but quite a few are. >>>>>>>> I'd like to hear from more people >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> - if they would like to have the names there (i.e. if it would >>>>>>>> help them finding a command) >>>>> >>>>> I would like the command names in the manual. >>>>> >>>>> - Emacs-lisp has a lovely tradition of naming functions *very* >>>>> descriptively and not being afraid to use long names in the =20 >>>>> interests >>>>> of accuracy. It's a shame to lose all that by displaying only key >>>>> sequences. It's a linguistic world of its own and I like being =20 >>>>> exposed >>>>> to it. >>>>> - While one can do C-h k, that's not the same as the way one =20 >>>>> learns the >>>>> function names by skimming the manual >>>> >>>> Also, it does not add length to the HTML version of the manual, =20 >>>> because >>>> the key sequences are already on a line of their own. And the =20 >>>> same is >>>> true for a certain proportion of the pdf entries (when the key =20 >>>> sequence >>>> is long, then it seems to go on its own line). >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>>>>> - if the position (first thing in the command description) >>>>>>>> is right, or if it would be better to have it >>>>>>>> - last thing in the description >>>>>>>> - or after the first sentence, this is how the GNUS manual >>>>>>>> does it. >>>>> >>>>> I definitely would want them out on a line of their own with the =20= >>>>> key >>>>> sequence. I liked the right-aligned model. >>>>> >>>>> Or if not right-aligned, is it possible not to have the comma? =20 >>>>> Maybe a >>>>> different font? >>> >>> I also like the position on the key line best. So if there is a >>> more-or-less >>> general agreement that we should get the names in, this would be my >>> preferred >>> location as well. I knot that this is different from what the emacs >>> and gnus manuals do - but I still think that a solution like this =20= >>> would >>> be better. >>> >>> Andreas, can you be bothered to rework the patch? >>> >>> Unfortunately I have no idea if/how the right-aligned model could be >>> made to >>> work. So I think the safest way to do this would be to introduce =20 >>> the macro, >>> and we can then work on the macro to get the formatting right, and =20= >>> also >>> to do the >>> key and function index stuff fully automatically. >>> >>> Here is my proposal for now: >>> >>> @macro orgcmd{key,command} >>> @kindex \key\ >>> @findex \command\ >>> @item \key\ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @r{(}\command\@r{)} >>> @end macro >>> >>> And then define keys/commands like this: >>> >>> @table @kbd >>> ..... >>> @orgcmd{@key{TAB}, org-cycle} >>> Here follows the description of the command >>> .... >>> @end table >>> >>> - Carsten >>> >>> >> [ ... ] >> >> Hi Carsten, >> >> attached a sreenshot, how it comes out for C-c C-b. >> Doesn't look ok for me, as back-tick and quote are uncommon that way. > > Hi Andreas, you are correct, this does not look right. > Seems like we will have to make the table ins @asis and > then have the macro apply the formatting. Sigh... :) If you do insert all the macro calls with the command names, I will =20 take care of the formatting. - Carsten