From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: "Sebastien Vauban" Subject: Re: [dev] About a beamer back-end Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2012 13:55:06 +0200 Message-ID: <80oboedwpx.fsf@somewhere.org> References: <87ehpg8vfo.fsf@gmail.com> <87ipep83ds.fsf@ucl.ac.uk> <87ehpbphcz.fsf@gmail.com> <87k3z32eug.fsf@ucl.ac.uk> <662913B2-BB47-4A3A-AACD-D7FC6F59927B@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Return-path: List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org-mXXj517/zsQ@public.gmane.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org-mXXj517/zsQ@public.gmane.org To: emacs-orgmode-mXXj517/zsQ@public.gmane.org Hi all, Greg Tucker-Kellogg wrote: > On Jun 20, 2012, at 5:04 AM, Eric S Fraga wrote: >> Nicolas Goaziou writes: >>> Eric S Fraga writes: >>> >>>> Well, I will have to chime in with a contrary view. I like using >>>> headlines to define blocks, and I use blocks on almost every frame. I >>>> have the following reasons for preferring a headline approach: >>>> >>>> - the proposed approach does not easily (at all?) cater for blocks >>>> within blocks >>> >>> I may be missing your point, but you can have nested blocks. What would be >>> more difficult to achieve with blocks? >> >> Sorry! I missed the begin...end structure for the blocks you were >> proposing. Indeed, I see no reason that your proposal does not support a >> recursive nesting of blocks. >> >>>> - ease of hiding of content: org for me is still primarily an >>>> outliner! >>> >>> You can hide blocks too. >> >> but the difference is that the hidden block doesn't tell you anything about >> the block itself? that is, there is no equivalent to the text content of a >> headline that is visible when the contents below the headline are hidden. >> This is possibly (?) a minor point, mind you. >> >>>> - being able to re-arrange content in a frame quickly (M-, etc.) >>> >>> See `org-element-drag-backward' and `org-element-drag-forward'. >> >> Okay. Will it be easy to bind these to M- etc. to achieve consistent >> behaviour? I.e. does org-metaup know what to do with blocks? >> >>>> - within frames, there is no other use for lower level headlines. Using >>>> these for blocks seems appropriate. What else could they be used for? >>> >>> Good question. >>> >>> One idea would be to use them as outline tools that would have no impact >>> on export (they would help hiding frame contents in the buffer but would >>> be ignored in produced LaTeX code). >>> >>> Obviously, both approaches (blocks or headlines) have drawbacks. I'm still >>> unsure about which one would be the quickest/cleanest/most useful. >> >> Understood! And I don't want to stand in the way of an implementation of >> beamer support in the new exporter. >> >> As a point for discussion and evaluation, attached is an example slide >> (both org and pdf) demonstrating the type of thing I tend to do for some of >> my beamer documents. >> >> Also, please don't forget about columns! > > I also quite like using headlines for blocks, for many of the same reasons > Eric mentioned. In addition, I regularly use column view to set BEAMER_env, > BEAMER_envargs, BEAMER_extra, etc., and column view operates on headlines. Personally, I dislike using headlines for *anything* that's in the frame. I like the idea that headlines do show the structure of your presentation: - (optionally) sections and subsections for the sidebar - frame title (and subtitle) and no more. Up to now, even if we could use headlines for itemized points, I preferred using proper Org itemized list, and keep the whole structured that way. I would add that headlines are inherently outline-oriented, while here we speak about block or column contents which are inherently block-oriented (maybe not really for the column contents, though). I've always have had difficulties with the way to represent example blocks, for example, *in* the flow of a normal slide... But this whole thing is just personal taste. I'm not coming with any solution, however! Best regards, Seb -- Sebastien Vauban