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From: "Alan E. Davis" <lngndvs@gmail.com>
Cc: org-mode <emacs-orgmode@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: a small remember suggestion
Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 12:01:45 +1000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <7bef1f890903211901g29bbc680r1547319ec608e942@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <7bef1f890903211425p1b1329ebxd42b3d7c1a3a77d7@mail.gmail.com>

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[I am reposting this to the list, as I'd intended.  IOt turned out I'd
responded only to the OP.]

I posted regarding this problem in an earlier thread about losing relatively
large and complex *remember* buffers that I had forgotten to save (C-c
C-c).  My usage has improved, and this has been much less of a problem;
however, after another, particularly painful incident, I am again studying
this problem.   I have tested two solutions that were presented earlier, but
neither one of them specifically solves this problem.  Each of them is a
workaround, and either one is acceptable as such, but requires certain
adjustments, albeit this is only slightly annoying;  I can learn to work
around them if need be.

I  may not have elucidated the problem clearly in the original post.  I use
remember every day, and have at least 50 different templates.  I have gotten
used to saving the notes with C-c C-c each time; however, when I'm working
late, am a bit tired, or the stress from work has gotten to me, I might---as
I did yesterday---spend a couple of hours studying a problem and make a
complex table of the partition structure of my machine, only to realize
after I had changed buffers a couple of times, and used remember at least
once more, only to discover that the I had failed to save the *remember*
template buffer.  Alas!  I throw up my hands in despair, but remembering
that the digital computer, I search for a backup file.  Backups have saved
me hundreds of hours, if not days, of work in the past.  Need I say more?

The *remember* buffer is not saved or backed up in any way.  The ideal
solution would be for this buffer to be automatically backed up---to
actually exist somewhere and be backed up just as a textmode buffer is.

Carsten earlier posted an at least partial solution to this problem.
#+BEGIN_SRC emacs-lisp
    (defadvice remember-finalize (before org-save-and-detach activate)
      (when buffer-file-name
        (setq buffer-file-name nil)))

    (add-hook 'remember-mode-hook
       (lambda ()
         (org-set-local 'change-major-mode-with-file-name nil)
         (write-file "~/path/to/remember_backup.org")
         (org-set-local 'remember-buffer (buffer-name)))

He said he would not include it in org-mode because one would be "using
remember out of its realm by making is a work buffer instead of a quick
capture-or-note buffer."  I admit I have used a wrench as a hammer at times,
to the chagrin of the true mechanic.  I have found remember a useful tool.
I admit I haven't understood its mechanism: I have even been confused by
it.  I use the templates, but am still a novice: I have written fairly
complicated org-remember templates, but I still haven't gotten my head
entirely around what they can do.  I have used it in whatever manner seemed
useful at the time.  So it is actually helpful to see how org-remember is
intended to be used, that one should immediately file his notes.  But I have
found this tool so useful (and my wrench is always handier than my hammer!)
in my own way, that I will continue to operate in my unorthodox mode.

All's the same, I hope  a convincing argument to include this solution.  I
would second the need to include a numbered backup mechanism to cover
recursive calls to org-remember.

That being said, I have also started using "%!" in some templates.  It feels
clumsy, but for the most part solves the problem, since I seldom use the
refiling options on the remember splash header.  It doesn't work as nicely
with complicated templates with several prompts, and it is capricious: for
example, I don't understand how to force the cursor to a particular

This problem happens at such a low frequency, for me, that an automatic
backup mechanism would be sufficient, especially if it recognized a second
instance of the *remember* buffer.

Something more transparent would be ideal.  I'm not sure how to organize
that the *remember* buffer would automatically be saved as a file
transparently, with numbered backups for new *remember* buffers.

Remember rocks!


On Sun, Mar 22, 2009 at 5:28 AM, Samuel Wales <samologist@gmail.com> wrote:

> org-remember -- use a file
> On more than one occasion, I have composed something using
> org-remember, and mistakenly hit a key for killing the
> buffer.  With all buffers except org-remember, this kills a
> buffer if it has no unsaved text, and asks what buffer to
> kill if it does, at which point I quit.
> With org-remember, the buffer has unsaved text, but it is
> not associated with a file, so it loses text.
> Text is probably lost upon a crash also.
> My suggestion is this.  Perhaps org-remember can have a file
> (this fixes the killing problem), and that file can be
> autosaved (this fixes the crash problem).[fn:4]
> There is one more case in which text is lost.  You might run
> org-remember from org-remember and not undo.  My existing
> proposal is to allow calling o-r from o-r.  I think that
> solves it.  In such a case, however, it will be necessary
> to allow more than one such file.
> [fn:4] In principle, if the target location is known, the
> file can be an indirect buffer into that buffer.  This has
> other advantages, including having all in-buffer settings
> work, being able to isearch, having a crashed org-remember
> stay where it is supposed to be (albeit unfinished) and so
> on.  But it wouldn't be necessary to get that fancy.  Just
> any file would work.
> --
> Myalgic encephalomyelitis denialism is causing death (decades early;
> Jason et al. 2006) and severe suffering (worse than nearly all other
> diseases studied; e.g. Schweitzer et al. 1995) and grossly corrupting
> science.  http://www.meactionuk.org.uk/What_Is_ME_What_Is_CFS.htm
> _______________________________________________
> Emacs-orgmode mailing list
> Remember: use `Reply All' to send replies to the list.
> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org
> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode

Alan Davis

"An inviscid theory of flow renders the screw useless, but the need for one
non-existent."                     ---Lord Raleigh (John William Strutt), or
else his son, who was also a scientist.

It is undesirable to believe a proposition when
there is no ground whatsoever for supposing it is true.
    ---- Bertrand Russell

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  parent reply	other threads:[~2009-03-22  2:01 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 14+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2009-03-21 19:28 a small remember suggestion Samuel Wales
     [not found] ` <7bef1f890903211425p1b1329ebxd42b3d7c1a3a77d7@mail.gmail.com>
2009-03-22  2:01   ` Alan E. Davis [this message]
2009-03-22 15:16     ` Carsten Dominik
2009-03-22 17:03       ` Richard Riley
2009-03-22 20:36       ` Alan E. Davis
2009-03-24  3:29       ` Samuel Wales
2009-03-24  3:42         ` Samuel Wales
2009-03-24 11:29           ` Carsten Dominik
2009-03-24 11:29         ` Carsten Dominik
2009-03-24 14:22           ` Alan E. Davis
2009-03-25  8:22             ` Carsten Dominik
2009-03-25  4:46           ` Samuel Wales
2009-03-25  6:24             ` Alan E. Davis
2009-03-25  8:23               ` Carsten Dominik

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