From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: Carsten Dominik Subject: Re: Beamer support in Org-mode Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2010 20:07:29 +0100 Message-ID: <6CC0A879-B435-47D5-9D5A-18986BA86F85@gmail.com> References: <6A790953-D036-4BAE-8833-E5B343A15331@gmail.com> <8F9C582F-F254-4FF7-A22B-E3D90081D380@gmail.com> <4b0ec920.0407c00a.1a73.1d20@mx.google.com> <87eimwb5he.wl%ucecesf@ucl.ac.uk> <6ac505ad0912151107i5944cc89ma18cfed98712d7f6@mail.gmail.com> <4b27e848.e302be0a.7924.08ae@mx.google.com> <20091218110607.GE5666@atlantic.linksys.moosehall> <9705.1261148787@alphaville.usa.hp.com> <6ac505ad0912181301v65646abdrb3f5252b433114f0@mail.gmail.com> <46810F0E-8972-409F-AA12-02654EFC12AC@tsdye.com> <4b2e3e17.1502be0a.017c.0e5f@mx.google.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v936) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-path: Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NRVnf-0005Oz-6t for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jan 2010 14:07:39 -0500 Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NRVna-0005MQ-CJ for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jan 2010 14:07:38 -0500 Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=43475 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NRVna-0005MN-Ae for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jan 2010 14:07:34 -0500 Received: from mail-ew0-f224.google.com ([209.85.219.224]:47186) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NRVnZ-0008T3-RA for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 03 Jan 2010 14:07:34 -0500 Received: by ewy24 with SMTP id 24so17289065ewy.26 for ; Sun, 03 Jan 2010 11:07:32 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <4b2e3e17.1502be0a.017c.0e5f@mx.google.com> List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org To: Darlan Cavalcante Moreira Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Hi everyone, after contemplating the \pnote proposal for beamer notes, I don't think that this is, in the end, the right solution. Can't we just use headings with a TODO keyword BNOTE or with property BNOTE or so as the sources of notes? Or, even simpler, Or we could use a special value "note" in the the BEAMER_env property to mark notes. This would be easy to turn on with the special editing code we already have, would automatically be tracked by a B_note tag and in this way stay visible. Using marked nodes would avoid choosing a specific level for such notes, and give the biggest flexibility. If we do this, then the following problem arises: An outline node always has a headline and content. What should be do with the headline? Should be throw it away? Or just make it part of the note text? Maybe that would make the most sense. Input is again welcome! - Carsten On Dec 20, 2009, at 4:08 PM, Darlan Cavalcante Moreira wrote: > > I also liked this idea. Since beamer does not track where the \note > command is > used inside the frame and just puts every note from that frame in > the next > "notes slide", then there is no loss if org-mode put several \note > commands in > the end of the frame environment when exporting. Therefore, a > headline below the > frame headline seems to be a good approach. > > Also, if the beamer notes are not desired when exporting to other > formats one > could add a tag to the "notes headline" and use the already > available feature of > not exporting headlines with a given tag. > > - Darlan Cavalcante Moreira > > At Sat, 19 Dec 2009 12:33:14 -1000, > "Thomas S. Dye" wrote: >> >> Hi Daniel, >> >> On Dec 18, 2009, at 11:01 AM, Daniel Martins wrote: >> >>> \pnote could be an option >>> >>> Another idea is to reserve the lowest level to notes >>> >>> * section >>> ** subsection >>> *** frame >>> etc >>> >>> >>> ************** notes >>> >>> (I don't know how many *'s are needed) >>> >>> maybe we can set a number / variable >>> >>> like >>> >>> org-beamer-frame-level >>> >>> we could create >>> >>> org-beamer-notes-level >>> >>> Daniel >>> >>> >>> 2009/12/18 Nick Dokos : >>>> Adam Spiers wrote: >>>> >>>>> On Tue, Dec 15, 2009 at 04:49:23PM -0300, Darlan Cavalcante >>>>> Moreira wrote: >>>>>> In addition, while I also agree that footnotes shouldn't be in a >>>>>> presentation >>>>>> they are allowed when working with beamer and may be useful in >>>>>> some cases. If >>>>>> org-mode export footnotes as beamer notes then some months from >>>>>> now someone >>>>>> would be asking here in the mailing-list how to enter a standard >>>>>> footnote when >>>>>> exporting to beamer. >>>>> >>>>> I agree - unfortunately there are genuinely sensible uses of >>>>> footnotes >>>>> in presentations. For example, citation of sources for >>>>> quotations, >>>>> data etc. is ideally accomplished by footnotes: they are not used >>>>> during the presentation itself, but by distributing paper and/or >>>>> electronic copies after the talk, footnotes provide essential >>>>> reference data for perusal by the audience at a later date. >>>>> >>>> I think that's an argument *for* Eric's idea (assuming that the >>>> handout >>>> includes notes - that's my practice, but maybe not everybody does >>>> that, >>>> although they *should* :-) ). >>>> >>>> In general, I think slides should be very simple: single-level >>>> lists, >>>> single idea per slide, no footnotes - but I know that generalities >>>> like >>>> that are just guidelines: meant to be broken, given a good enough >>>> cause. >>>> >>>>> Imagine a slide showing the results of a benchmark, claiming "X is >>>>> much faster than Y!" You might want to talk briefly about how the >>>>> results were obtained, and about the impact of the results, but >>>>> you >>>>> would also need to be able to tell the audience they could >>>>> independently verify the results by obtaining a copy of the slides >>>>> and >>>>> visiting the URL contained in the footnote - especially if the >>>>> results >>>>> are controversial! In this case, it would not matter that the URL >>>>> was >>>>> too small to be legible from the back of the room. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> How does inverting Eric's idea sound: invent a new kind of >>>> footnote, >>>> let's call it, say, a "pnote", which is treated exactly like a >>>> footnote in >>>> all exports *except* beamer. In beamer, footnotes end up in the >>>> frame >>>> and pnotes end up in the notes. >>>> >>>> Not sure whether the implementation would be as simple as this >>>> makes it >>>> sound, but who knows?[1] >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> Nick >>>> >>>> [1] Well, OK: Carsten knows... >>>> >> >> FWIW, I like this idea. I think it tracks the mapping between beamer >> and LaTeX very well. >> >> In my experience, beamer slide shows are an aid in the spoken >> presentation of a LaTeX article. >> >> Beamer does a good job of mapping the higher level LaTeX sectioning >> commands, with some themes that automatically display down to >> subsection. To my mind, frames in beamer capture lower-level >> structure (e.g. subsubsection, paragraph, subparagraph) in their >> (often over-used) bulleted lists, and (more appropriately) the >> photographs, diagrams, maps etc. that are inserted as figures in the >> LaTeX article. As others on the list have noted, LaTeX footnotes >> also >> map fairly directly to beamer footnotes. >> >> This leaves most of the text of the article, which from my >> perspective >> maps to beamer notes. Marking off notes with the headline below the >> last one that deals with frames and their paraphernalia seems natural >> to me. The typical org-mode file that exports to LaTeX will have big >> chunks that transfer very readily to the notes sections of a beamer >> presentation. >> >> I don't know whether the idea makes sense from the point of view of >> implementation, though, because I can't really read the org-mode Lisp >> code owing to my own illiteracy. >> >> All the best, >> Tom >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Emacs-orgmode mailing list >> Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. >> Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org >> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode > > > _______________________________________________ > Emacs-orgmode mailing list > Please use `Reply All' to send replies to the list. > Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org > http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-orgmode - Carsten