From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp11.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms5.migadu.com with LMTPS id r2NQO6Dg2mNu4AAAbAwnHQ (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 01 Feb 2023 22:58:57 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:2:bcc0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp11.migadu.com with LMTPS id QN6NOqDg2mOlQwEA9RJhRA (envelope-from ) for ; Wed, 01 Feb 2023 22:58:56 +0100 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8FA9535B97 for ; Wed, 1 Feb 2023 22:58:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pNL7B-0006nt-In; Wed, 01 Feb 2023 16:58:01 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pNL76-0006nd-3A for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 01 Feb 2023 16:57:56 -0500 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.19]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pNL74-0004Gy-BA for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Wed, 01 Feb 2023 16:57:55 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.at; s=s31663417; t=1675288668; bh=a8/1bKHk5xLBEdHsL+fm3vQn627oh3SO3VaFvLhPEyk=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=C50MuUKUoWWBPlE/6b66ygtBDtwTRU1DntFprDOYm3xuceCHseipz+/cVfbZ0mCt4 bNG7ogBmEjQP8usae1rsIv+vHYjJJ5R8YBv7o2OvUrWHLPD1dY3bBtx8q2r9STn0iD LbEOB76Nzd7a+Lu/7JC6QjhgEQtWAACk0d4cC3DFBsKxwXyy5mnK71qbsCfz6Pslc0 8tmqCv1HnLsB9Ch0ke1qcBLnRfrD/N+he9opJ7xqnph1fiIni/W3cTHMzy29n9NfZq +hlVQmi2QC1l6lEkVnhHrjwQYwgNPnZUHRKIEx0lCFhYjDX/t6izdQCxvBSBHsO54/ U7iNo787t0qmQ== X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a Received: from [192.168.2.102] ([80.121.69.21]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx004 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MWzk3-1p88g63Hkf-00XJeu for ; Wed, 01 Feb 2023 22:57:48 +0100 Subject: Re: POSIX TS spec reverses the meaning of TZ offset compared to ISO (was: [POLL] Proposed syntax for timestamps with time zone info To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org References: <63ca1283.170a0220.5bc81.0fdd@mx.google.com> <87pmb9k8oi.fsf@tsdye.online> <3035CDD5-41DD-4516-9E4E-9E0DF16BE2E0@gmail.com> <87lelo8c9r.fsf@localhost> <2150768.1675077958@archlinux> <87tu063ox2.fsf@localhost> <87r0v9sio1.fsf@christianmoe.com> <87edr9lgq6.fsf@localhost> <87o7qdsf7h.fsf@christianmoe.com> <87v8kljz3n.fsf@localhost> From: Heinz Tuechler Message-ID: <5dbbab8f-bec8-9272-2a07-b8e484b93c85@gmx.at> Date: Wed, 1 Feb 2023 22:57:47 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:ysEPwlO+YdRf2vALhIhMeCljSAVQkhC7k7yC2qmI9OYkabpUo/P yYi3N9sJwvop9Mvy90gMvStJvDQZ5CAw4STVTj/lbfNIe2P7giTEPe9qd4cVTAhi96SCP+n ltkYK0GMQiZ228z2rVCcda9Kpcrj015ojFwU2G9i+WoHkqgO3LyK7FjqslbEXd6zc5eeXeS 2s9hklC4Nc0XQ851se4Ag== UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:omqDOCzYnvE=;45uApiCAO22nTST7IlFT7bwf+q0 cdgHXfigut+hywwNicCcsvtM59qRw5fCDr7GSVB+kced1NLuj/f2I+1LCvCDl82evotAqgYvK v6sGJEhgJX01XoMCUE6eSxR6p7gJEebBV2Pagl14taY1/96iYa9kyneHrbN9Ga2yAoYBQEzI7 uLtQmv35tpGxVwyjJfGkVDf0/QJTFdBaFikO9z1j81632ZwBGxRQMMYtEPiew6pzaU+Z5rfOQ bGjq0b5TH9G9jBb00X7TmcSAekb2TId4oSi2xYg7dBxjlecls/QRZRrbS+41uRovdla1PGcAl Z4GgXzYrmXrUC69WAFqQEoUR9h9TM+59hR5oWkclICc7XicWlrTdGK21fvwQsdJ9v0NSg+6hh 0v41Rhjaq81teS90c/RunbMiAuY+YoDJTLH5zIGBULpoBWLl4fQcp9DSpqV+VX4kZ0YQkWkxG UepIAR8dRnqP2vU5v+mZ98D+K/VtvJZ9qx3BQK3ZQBX7an4Y6kaOSgnA6hBk2nfTyHr4DJi5E iqF3UCjSOVsG+ZcnnwaqYSeHxEXUtx6qDLOwKRDnbwhRcEiIoYX3PUZE5H22BdG8e+t3mX5dB g47JtvcZo3w6jWQQ9xEDh2xHl4zDhhW/z8OvzZphyaXgka9vNvopYAAORGgTaW+NiOWy39eZ/ 0iRN1iCY+T6Rn9Kc63mhGXObilTUIZ+3HgOTRa9I2KoF/e1Dks8iCYtH6rlGZekhf2MohycpL bbi5usj4EJNH1R0Utxuu3WioPVgZPSwoOBnKKLAxhNBFRmpjt4YEI5wqn7zTeC1Z68aKwWU0u CcLPvdZDMVNDGVmviykYPWyzLX2G9B5g1E3UPOzZxKR6rK1rA44dZmihJsJ6j9QiOVx/hljSr 2dCvddmyzYq8sBm9ZJoE1zK/BkP96XAKBGwWDBcAGXHS9NRq3cS6PrmcbGOkWB0UUMRxbkfTH cO2twA== Received-SPF: pass client-ip=212.227.15.19; envelope-from=tuechler@gmx.at; helo=mout.gmx.net X-Spam_score_int: -28 X-Spam_score: -2.9 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.09, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1675288736; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=PV9h7+xq4wJ9B3h36xYcFKRb4YKCLehVLuzVKnW9UBVglKk+VhdWlk722/CZaTfL9xJd7e isfWW2KsRYATqmEsNLbLbTU5B/PLry2+953xK/4l2kmS6flncOf8oUY8X7SMUn4X+dszFQ WPLwFaw/FZGEBdttoPWzMqp2IuK3Z0lu0n9WwvkHGMyjHY0BM+U8kk4oBbVou6g66Eu3oa 3LXJGTHy6hxhUPQkmsPyp7eJu5+cUWT9qZriTUjN6EcmGz6Icum/NiYbhc80Vp7SOYIGsj z6GRIksHk/Kbk93WChebDor48vi3mTn3wEVFDpGXS1R0iSj/PTi7hRHibHQAcw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmx.at header.s=s31663417 header.b=C50MuUKU; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmx.at ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1675288736; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=a8/1bKHk5xLBEdHsL+fm3vQn627oh3SO3VaFvLhPEyk=; b=emJoSnC7k4XJS48tkzso2FiSsiYkauprNmJ8nVmHGhRLHgH7ti+mryZnORRb+mH+nu1Gv9 TTTce4nVPVixZWg5AoOHF7Xpcbbpz9rjtX38nq5zidBcE0biCHiONA6IvDXaPRhV2ZNDtr 54L8DwOzodhlzn3LVyjP1Bt+bXWdbqDO7PVhwjGCvpgMFaXbjo3Gxf2SDF73nGLZFwd3IA 2YR+mUZGnGG1zgeWAPL4fwLDRFLiL15OWKhRzeZLahwKqGdvmvUu+XXvTxUAmCPmR/8iAs yU0BJVMqtWdxq2yANaXyElG99260cSfjwqU6nIUwMwrtm1rCXKF41QMmiryWHQ== Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=gmx.at header.s=s31663417 header.b=C50MuUKU; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmx.at X-Migadu-Scanner: scn1.migadu.com X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -4.71 X-Spam-Score: -4.71 X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 8FA9535B97 X-TUID: XkVyJdWrHxge tomas@tuxteam.de wrote/hat geschrieben on/am 01.02.2023 14:51: > On Wed, Feb 01, 2023 at 01:26:36PM +0000, Ihor Radchenko wrote: >> [ adding Org ML back to CC ] >> >> Christian Moe writes: >> >>>> Note, however, that because we are conforming to POSIX TZ, @UTC+2 is = two >>>> hours _behind_ the Greenwich. >>> >>> Ouch. >> >> This is probably something we need to discuss further. >> >> Dear All, >> >> There is potential confusion coming from the different interpretations >> of the time zone offsets used in ISO8601 and POSIX TZ specs: > > This is unfortunate indeed. I'd tend to pick one and not to allow > both, out of fear of counfusion. And if I had to pick one, I'd pick > ISO, which I've seen more often in the wild. But this might quite > well be some sort of bias. > > Cheers > Same for me, I usually see ISO offset. Further, I am used to exchange time designations (CET, EST, PDT,...) instead of [continent/city] timezone names. My impression is that many of non experts like me don't know in which time zone they are living. Is it trivial to find the [continent/city] timezone name to a specific place? best, Heinz