From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:403:58f0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms8.migadu.com with LMTPS id mFOAJSdcAGbzBwAA62LTzQ:P1 (envelope-from ) for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2024 18:00:23 +0100 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:403:58f0::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp1.migadu.com with LMTPS id mFOAJSdcAGbzBwAA62LTzQ (envelope-from ) for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2024 18:00:23 +0100 X-Envelope-To: larch@yhetil.org Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.jp header.s=2017 header.b=n1XFcF3Z; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.jp ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1711299623; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=gFGByN3/StCM7fDQlaInPTP/TtpnbXATevmTIRKBDjM=; b=BCBcrDQTxiBRzP7yQp5+Gb9aPra1+0jpui0efS2tXC6u3JAkimoGNDapZDchIOHuosczjw SYUuYPY+DKNziaTyq6Xv8RjrhKcUbXh2bQOiuyQgo2CdnOvCUW8gsAWN3k+RCTKwIoUeLr HvPqJWN6jtu6sJlT/sUQM+GG3eCWXZNrAwRd7DZWfbVP6aVj35196/kYTtIR//mI46gYe+ HtkWZz98apt1j+yKAOjxjEsBBQRfRetV5SS6kHqCdg2Dnvc4zIikVQ6BO4eTj8ShQFE3F+ VIYaOOUOgWe+dC/91bPPMqK7IgrmfKpQNa43On2ZfBpUQIb7NVBBdtLBYqt1gw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=posteo.jp header.s=2017 header.b=n1XFcF3Z; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of "emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org" designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom="emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org"; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=posteo.jp ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1711299623; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=qNeQWvBrw6cHRRRUwCJbFV7EpMkd33PpInWKaRqzSBP9Sjt3z99FpinO2p1n9cDH76RyB9 ZwbTimSDQAQkVdy7TVNMhFW4hnIk/wiaVs51kLOeK28nyZBF1+uvmQG7UL6P7/gg7cyaVH DxjXe+6yBCeuQlApLcKdbn5WImzdLI4G//dBmKDIF8sp7uP1LYkwuPDamvXLcjjug1DrTZ rHXl0qYwUZueO80IZbkGr9OoGas7ArgKMDiFZCErfRyTr2ZaTKjGT1Lxie3Han45XJ5vFu 3janpalL7TyWeu3TpJIu5zCnrmkJZQuXNf9HScEqNa2iiUipxEnJ394izvEw5g== Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2DA4E3D32A for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2024 18:00:23 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1roRBq-0001wk-MI; Sun, 24 Mar 2024 12:59:22 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1roRBp-0001vt-Bm for Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 24 Mar 2024 12:59:21 -0400 Received: from mout02.posteo.de ([185.67.36.66]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1roRBm-0005j2-Dd for Emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 24 Mar 2024 12:59:21 -0400 Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout02.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 80692240101 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2024 17:59:14 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.jp; s=2017; t=1711299554; bh=E9zZw1MjEJJBakJ7OtBq3etNheUvQa66DJ+uMtzLCkg=; h=Date:From:To:Subject:MIME-Version:Content-Type: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-Id:From; b=n1XFcF3ZJyKKdEMvS1Q/dGKMaSL4fP1WoQmJ3KZk331zyzj8DW54L7m5LvKQopMA3 wWf81+yl6WIqMivMDRLSl/NGIazC8lWo8acrsPyzx8P0e8nq/7SD831n9v0kKOQjkw MLxM3YMTe0ZMdJVpFBC+Z3ovQmz26xPf7i78Zv5MONVjC+5gfpfGubdfWal+JS6C4n qdnPY3R8MlDfG4mNl5AhHLUABViQGp9L+CrEIhgabBvYyqzsgJ4qBoPw6PFglrgZok 1JFCvTx0tNUxt71ZX/zJAiFdVuizfFbF212qBzstGbrup//NNFzK52WbdfTpZoyvv0 UGgCRzGEiklig== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4V2j2p0Trxz9rxR for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2024 17:59:13 +0100 (CET) Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2024 16:59:10 +0000 From: To: Emacs orgmode Subject: Re: Presenting Hyperorg version 0.1.0: The Org to HTML Converter In-Reply-To: <878r27bslj.fsf@localhost> References: <87sf0lrqw2.fsf@localhost> <4V20vC3RwXz6twc@submission01.posteo.de> <875xxd6oeo.fsf@localhost> <4V28mv5Q3rz6tyS@submission01.posteo.de> <87h6gvbvt8.fsf@localhost> <9e466e7e9d9de12103df770ace706d21@posteo.de> <878r27bslj.fsf@localhost> Followup-To: Emacs orgmode MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <4V2j2p2Pf9z9rxS@submission02.posteo.de> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.66; envelope-from=c.buhtz@posteo.jp; helo=mout02.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN X-Migadu-Country: US X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 2DA4E3D32A X-Spam-Score: -10.02 X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -10.02 X-Migadu-Scanner: mx11.migadu.com X-TUID: kWzgT635PTPs Dear Ihor, I will consider your points and take them into account. On 2024-03-24 14:40 Ihor Radchenko wrote: > If it is an option, it would be nice if you upstreamed your additions > to orgparse. This way, we can get a better Python-based Org parser for > everyone's benefit. The code is free. The orgparse maintainer is free to re-use it of course. On the other hand in the long run I will consider to separate my parsing code into an extra package. But currently it is to unstable and do support only a small subset of all org(roam) features. > > Orgparse do throw exceptions e.g. UnicodeDecodeError or when > > timestamps are invalid. Hyperorg catch that exceptions and go on > > with the next node without interrupting the whole process. > > I see. FYI, it is a bug to throw an error when parsing Org document. > Any kind of text file is a valid Org document. There is no notion of > invalid syntax in Org markup. You mean throw an error is a bug because it is not possible to write invalid org documents? I am not convinced yet. But I am open to it and willing to learn. Even org-html-export* itself do throw errors and stop processing when there are unknown orgids. What is about an inconsistent block? #begin_src foobar #end_example > > Other things are "invalid" links, e.g. unknown orgids, unknown roam > > links, unsupported "link kinds" ("protocols" in org syntax?; e.g. > > "inkscape:"). > > In Org terminology, we call these "broken" links. > "link kinds" are link "types". The term "types" is to broad and conflicts with Pythons in build functions. ;) That is the main reason why I used "kind". On the other hand the org syntax reference IMHO also use the term "protocol". > Do you mean that orgparse throws an error when encountering tables? No. I was referring to Hyperorg. OrgParse do not parse any org content except headings and properties. Nearly everything else is unparsed and given raw to my. > Generally, part of the "Benefits" section is a bit hand-wavy. I > recommend using more clear statements. Otherwise, it is not clear what > exactly the benefits are. Again. It is also not "clear" for me. There are benefits just for myself as an low-level-Emacs-and-org-user, someone who get headaches reading Lisp code and feeling very comfortable using Python. In short: My opinion is very subjective. And I don't have enough experience to compare my tool to others. I tried to make this point clear in my benefits section. And this is also the reason why there was no benefits section in the first place because I wasn't clear enough about what to write in there. Maybe I should rephrase the section to "Benefits and design goals". > 1. Drop "Fairly resilient when dealing with parser issues." Why? The "design goal" is to process all nodes no matter how bad/invalid they are. > 2. Reword "Fairly resilient managing dead and problematic links which > are a common phenomenon when working with a constantly evolving > Zettelkasten or personal wiki." And instead clearly explain how broken > links are exported. I don't want to blow up the text. Not sure what you expect here. The node is exported as HTML but the link is colorful highlighted and a tooltip explaining the problem is added. > 4. Drop "Adhers to World Wide Web Consortium (W3C) standards for HTML5 > and CSS ()." Most other blog exporters for Org mode > adhere to standards. And those that are not are probably out of > interest for the purposes of comparison. Why? Btw: Even code generated by org-html-export* (XHTML 1.0 Strict) give errors on W3C. e.g. "type" attribute is missing in