From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andreas_R=F6hler?= Subject: Re: Re: keys and command name info Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2010 21:07:51 +0200 Message-ID: <4C683B07.6090206@easy-emacs.de> References: <4C5086C1.9060000@easy-emacs.de> <20100808222636.GF20223@shi.workgroup> <770A61DC-4063-4A72-95F2-21F4E7DE6E77@gmail.com> <87fwyom8iv.fsf@gmx.net> <20100809101957.GC14007@shi.workgroup> <878w4f4oy4.fsf@stats.ox.ac.uk> <87tyn337rm.fsf@stats.ox.ac.uk> <21306250-E2A2-46A7-BFB5-891034F3FA59@gmail.com> <4C659D63.1090003@easy-emacs.de> <86490E4E-6B55-4596-82A9-1BDD1079B1F0@uva.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Return-path: Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=55980 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1Okjoh-0002l1-Np for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 15 Aug 2010 16:28:29 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Okiaq-0003B9-VL for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 15 Aug 2010 15:10:10 -0400 Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de ([212.227.17.10]:51343) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Okiaq-000355-JP for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Sun, 15 Aug 2010 15:10:04 -0400 In-Reply-To: <86490E4E-6B55-4596-82A9-1BDD1079B1F0@uva.nl> List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+geo-emacs-orgmode=m.gmane.org@gnu.org To: Carsten Dominik Cc: emacs-orgmode , Carsten Dominik Am 15.08.2010 09:39, schrieb Carsten Dominik: > > On Aug 15, 2010, at 9:37 AM, Carsten Dominik wrote: > >> >> On Aug 13, 2010, at 9:30 PM, Andreas Röhler wrote: >> >>> Am 11.08.2010 12:05, schrieb Carsten Dominik: >>>> >>>> On Aug 9, 2010, at 9:28 PM, Dan Davison wrote: >>>> >>>>> Dan Davison writes: >>>>> >>>>>> Gregor Zattler writes: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Andreas, org-mode developers, >>>>>>> * Andreas Burtzlaff [09. Aug. 2010]: >>>>>>>> Carsten Dominik writes: >>>>>>>>> I have put a version of the manual as modified by Andreas here: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> http://orgmode.org/org-manual-with-command-names.pdf >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Not all the command names are in there, but quite a few are. >>>>>>>>> I'd like to hear from more people >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> - if they would like to have the names there (i.e. if it would >>>>>>>>> help them finding a command) >>>>>> >>>>>> I would like the command names in the manual. >>>>>> >>>>>> - Emacs-lisp has a lovely tradition of naming functions *very* >>>>>> descriptively and not being afraid to use long names in the interests >>>>>> of accuracy. It's a shame to lose all that by displaying only key >>>>>> sequences. It's a linguistic world of its own and I like being >>>>>> exposed >>>>>> to it. >>>>>> - While one can do C-h k, that's not the same as the way one >>>>>> learns the >>>>>> function names by skimming the manual >>>>> >>>>> Also, it does not add length to the HTML version of the manual, >>>>> because >>>>> the key sequences are already on a line of their own. And the same is >>>>> true for a certain proportion of the pdf entries (when the key >>>>> sequence >>>>> is long, then it seems to go on its own line). >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>>> - if the position (first thing in the command description) >>>>>>>>> is right, or if it would be better to have it >>>>>>>>> - last thing in the description >>>>>>>>> - or after the first sentence, this is how the GNUS manual >>>>>>>>> does it. >>>>>> >>>>>> I definitely would want them out on a line of their own with the key >>>>>> sequence. I liked the right-aligned model. >>>>>> >>>>>> Or if not right-aligned, is it possible not to have the comma? >>>>>> Maybe a >>>>>> different font? >>>> >>>> I also like the position on the key line best. So if there is a >>>> more-or-less >>>> general agreement that we should get the names in, this would be my >>>> preferred >>>> location as well. I knot that this is different from what the emacs >>>> and gnus manuals do - but I still think that a solution like this would >>>> be better. >>>> >>>> Andreas, can you be bothered to rework the patch? >>>> >>>> Unfortunately I have no idea if/how the right-aligned model could be >>>> made to >>>> work. So I think the safest way to do this would be to introduce the >>>> macro, >>>> and we can then work on the macro to get the formatting right, and also >>>> to do the >>>> key and function index stuff fully automatically. >>>> >>>> Here is my proposal for now: >>>> >>>> @macro orgcmd{key,command} >>>> @kindex \key\ >>>> @findex \command\ >>>> @item \key\ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @r{(}\command\@r{)} >>>> @end macro >>>> >>>> And then define keys/commands like this: >>>> >>>> @table @kbd >>>> ..... >>>> @orgcmd{@key{TAB}, org-cycle} >>>> Here follows the description of the command >>>> .... >>>> @end table >>>> >>>> - Carsten >>>> >>>> >>> [ ... ] >>> >>> Hi Carsten, >>> >>> attached a sreenshot, how it comes out for C-c C-b. >>> Doesn't look ok for me, as back-tick and quote are uncommon that way. >> >> Hi Andreas, you are correct, this does not look right. >> Seems like we will have to make the table ins @asis and >> then have the macro apply the formatting. Sigh... :) > > If you do insert all the macro calls with the command names, I will take > care of the formatting. > > - Carsten > Hi, will do that. Let us check nonetheless a working example first. While trying to put @asis at the right place, I get error messages and it refuses to compile. Could you re-write the example for me? Sorry being that stupid :-) Andreas