From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from mp2 ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by ms0.migadu.com with LMTPS id Wyu0NUx9gmDqdgAAgWs5BA (envelope-from ) for ; Fri, 23 Apr 2021 09:54:52 +0200 Received: from aspmx1.migadu.com ([2001:41d0:8:6d80::]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)) by mp2 with LMTPS id oM1hMEx9gmCVZQAAB5/wlQ (envelope-from ) for ; Fri, 23 Apr 2021 07:54:52 +0000 Received: from lists.gnu.org (lists.gnu.org [209.51.188.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by aspmx1.migadu.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 36FE52BA0C for ; Fri, 23 Apr 2021 09:54:52 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1]:51718 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lZqeI-0004fn-BQ for larch@yhetil.org; Fri, 23 Apr 2021 03:54:50 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:49352) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lZqdf-0004dS-LP for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Apr 2021 03:54:11 -0400 Received: from mail.tuxteam.de ([5.199.139.25]:42379) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lZqdb-0002Ch-VS for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Apr 2021 03:54:11 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tuxteam.de; s=mail; h=From:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version:References:Message-ID:Subject:To:Date; bh=tsjGL5/OJf7DPbnyFbdtzmHmiYotMCXkXWE9qeV2ktk=; b=I6PVZZL+UQs39oi/tACHPqR030o7TkxWvZrUBNlFrvzhkGZ9KGVEA0fqiFjycrHg+CRxTZYsXlEbxRUX7CzmM0VVIPDTRweza5yVE+8CDP3deWr+rHaQHtLOq6RZUh2UbXxBcE1IolFhtB2kRYYyTWQ9/tO3I1MLV55Ni8WS4j2YSx8EhkfkbVEoguCrEus2gBjSqZKBCWufIp+3os7FsOxqut/4G7TzVJHoyiMwFLGxXfgm6a3ghChP4WmHWE1XqhWop/56ylRjCYiXReCHTizwzKqt7OkFm5xADzGEU1jWKRHjNPFpestK8cVNrMGCqalqSmw34dyTqGy22GOm4w==; Received: from tomas by mail.tuxteam.de with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1lZqdU-0003pA-76 for emacs-orgmode@gnu.org; Fri, 23 Apr 2021 09:54:00 +0200 Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2021 09:54:00 +0200 To: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org Subject: Re: Idea for handling timezones Message-ID: <20210423075400.GB10750@tuxteam.de> References: <20210403150042.GK27597@maokai> <701561.1617475882@apollo2.minshall.org> <87y2dz54sk.fsf@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="ftEhullJWpWg/VHq" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) From: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=5.199.139.25; envelope-from=tomas@tuxteam.de; helo=mail.tuxteam.de X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "General discussions about Org-mode." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1619164492; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type:in-reply-to:in-reply-to: references:references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe: list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=tsjGL5/OJf7DPbnyFbdtzmHmiYotMCXkXWE9qeV2ktk=; b=pPfF0SGSKLQG14qc+UqEL9LNMJLEzyyP4JTUAEPdwCWDZWBYoRxurTiMd0J4Onx3xu9mcK Uyo/iE1Pemi5+ZcI/X1WDE31MPwhtJJPtSg3R8ww/etGizTOWLCUBoBkBt0Wm2lS8aCgEb oRmwLk1Lu3aMF0o5Y2dy+SfRi1WFzhMfFPYMezqJO0OhEIuhYBotBD7SIuPOxvheeyMpKG fUPhALa9cC/1lbrLcdEwT2FmbMoOoaUm5xMRClziYa/71Nzkw1iIrP9UFbp3kp2xEGLQhy PFx+O3dzI2AvKuq0hx8c5ihUKKgg7g4kdc4m8dNhKSBKjtjnkH0sBzJaRUMzxg== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1619164492; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=VSe43zhQ1DoWTHnpXJwJY0hqpqGwlqQUKHnkTurqaey+PtxDZDEZxSDcrt8Axivyl4o4x3 zy8vsnHglfspajlErO92S6eEx9aUwnDeh2PbN+8UYcZRVx3oU7YhWmbpIdT3dheK8MTeN+ 913U+XM7OyeR7Dl8Sc8Y9BniVoKjlnaw++pa7yHklimUCZ5bRk9I7tDWJNVlBnt9bA/8fO 9RBKHzuIE7wB+cXbMY0G3xUzk4SQS5fuYSWWEpldQJVHJJBt/VQmOl+UNsFadU4JYmWOKP L+OZHxFR9tjvKsu7WyFciWezUdaf8A5orB5Dd6BogVA1uk8SdtmgXe1daTtWHQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=tuxteam.de header.s=mail header.b=I6PVZZL+; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -3.25 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=tuxteam.de header.s=mail header.b=I6PVZZL+; dmarc=none; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 36FE52BA0C X-Spam-Score: -3.25 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: eAV33noRjKyS --ftEhullJWpWg/VHq Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Apr 23, 2021 at 09:45:14AM +0800, Shironeko wrote: > Hi all, >=20 > I originally thought having the timezone in the header of the file would = make > things simpler, since it meant all the timestamp would be in the same tim= ezone, > rather than potentially different ones. But it seems that that might not = be > inline with how others use their org files. >=20 > org actually already has a keyword for a per entry timezone,=20 > https://orgmode.org/manual/iCalendar-Export.html > The problem with it is that no other facility of org plugs into that, it = only > counts when exporting into other calendar systems, which I think is stran= ge. If > it is indeed better to be able to set timezone per entry, then I think > supporting this properly in org would be best. Interesting idea. If I understand the doc correctly, the iCalendar exporter picks up timezone information from a property of the "enclosing" heading, if present. > Only having CST etc timezone abbreviations is indeed problematic, because= it is > ambiguous and kinda difficult to enter, also people don't necessarily > communicate with the correct designation (maybe they mean EDT but used ES= T, but > the time is unambiguously EDT). They seem more fragile than time offsets, yes. Much implicit environment. Some folks seem to still have strong preferences for that (not me, mind you). > With repeat tasks I don't think it would be a problem for tasks that repe= ats > daily or longer (since by definition they add to the day/month/year direc= tly, > not counting how many days there are in a month for example). For hourly > repeating tasks it is indeed ambiguous, but I don't have an idea on what = would > be better. Maybe people that have those can chime in. Actually, repeating tasks are clear use cases for those "mushy" time zones: "we meet every second and fourth Thursday every month at 19h30"=20 almost surely means "at whatever time the local clocks say it is half past seven in the afternoon", so daylight saving corrections will apply. Decisions, decisions :-) Don't get me wrong: I'm not trying to discourage you to pick that up, I'm happy someone has the spirit to do so! Cheers - t --ftEhullJWpWg/VHq Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: Digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAmCCfRgACgkQBcgs9XrR2kaqPwCdFYjq2umEb74z3wr3JqS07aoh 3O8AnjZcxT+Uie9sbnnGis/s/3kjIw/A =rriT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --ftEhullJWpWg/VHq--