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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-orgmode-bounces+larch=yhetil.org@gnu.org Sender: "Emacs-orgmode" X-Migadu-Flow: FLOW_IN ARC-Message-Signature: i=2; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yhetil.org; s=key1; t=1625441004; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post:dkim-signature; bh=dnHxPP6kaNjfEc/ageQcwnN8g4fJAXtGgvZLm8aIGnE=; b=CPgFGTEiEyL2/91ol8BTCm3zLEA3/vDo4awdXX6mV7PbE6Ad8mAhJCigRnVzEBlvT/yrBC aDTTLeXaZVNRDyEmQLLfxvxB6NYIJugFzg5xc+Qb4AwkE1VIHd0LmWCQau0PAIcV2DeHY4 psGZuUSW6swjD6oWMp83nNPxbLQP4Me0LG39gY+3NDcmM4ilBjpCJYenXrZXreBH5ERV1o XXlFjF7166YJrhU2iE9TR3P9qTaADzcroEdqKyhEmP3Hu7ZHdtxCmRvTVKhzDihtcAyZ9I 1EsFMQ4UWp7d3kgxyS0tzR4ZGlVLF6rl0IvBw9zBV3ZU9p0MXF3Q2x9FIyN6kw== ARC-Seal: i=2; s=key1; d=yhetil.org; t=1625441004; a=rsa-sha256; cv=pass; b=u5I8nim6Eu0Y0BuUKYmYkfvS2lu6yXn7bw2tPgTtA7KK6TL5l1ORukCZwC4RdUirVfhfvd c920GG9X7TXw4ZT64NNHSvtZPOITe39P2jH2SLtT/6/I0s/KgOuLZh/r26OhVypFs4iCux 1ajhzxl+KIrK03uIUikGZwpY5AXNDtowJqLo632YgceO0kpP1GM0MSzw40BSagtGEycg/D hnuZRzg4qS0P5qEE6IAE3XubKO+CHupFPfamezu6LiyaGV1fyxrDOEccLM51JnBx43/XpF 6xQlCHL8YHbgOOgH0IqkMRgWNZcQ6Qgxu7pY4SHsuILWSab6CuH32Xttt9vikw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=2; aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=oracle.com header.s=corp-2020-01-29 header.b=oTKMxdv9; dkim=pass header.d=oracle.onmicrosoft.com header.s=selector2-oracle-onmicrosoft-com header.b=GxIiN49e; arc=pass ("microsoft.com:s=arcselector9901:i=1"); spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Spam-Score: -2.61 Authentication-Results: aspmx1.migadu.com; dkim=pass header.d=oracle.com header.s=corp-2020-01-29 header.b=oTKMxdv9; dkim=pass header.d=oracle.onmicrosoft.com header.s=selector2-oracle-onmicrosoft-com header.b=GxIiN49e; arc=pass ("microsoft.com:s=arcselector9901:i=1"); dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=oracle.com; spf=pass (aspmx1.migadu.com: domain of emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org designates 209.51.188.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=emacs-orgmode-bounces@gnu.org X-Migadu-Queue-Id: 7BD6D2D77F X-Spam-Score: -2.61 X-Migadu-Scanner: scn0.migadu.com X-TUID: 0ZpcNdF8VZz9 I highly recommend a recent LibreOffice.  Nearly everything I do is through LibreOffice and CSV files.  MS Excel has problems when using inter-field-separators such as semicolons. When I receive Excel (or other) spreadsheets from people, I must first convert them into CSV files to clear out the crazy manual formatting in order to process them content. Often a flow such as this helps: *.xlsx => *.csv => Emacs (to cleanup text, newlines, whitespace) => LibreOffice (to sort, reorder, analyze with better use of graphical realestate) => *.org tables with Emacs macros to process further => *.csv => LibreOffice to generate fresh *.xlsx Sometimes cleanup with *nix 'cut' and 'paste' tools helps greatly: - *.csv => cut -d\; -f1-3 >file1 - *.csv => cut -d\; -f4- >file2 - Edit content or add a new set of data - paste -d';' file1 file2 etc. Very powerful. On 7/4/21 5:00 PM, Tim Cross wrote: > Uwe Brauer writes: > >> Hi >> >> A couple of days ago I asked about importing excel formula into org >> tables, and they only ways seems to do it manually. >> >> I just realised that I need it also the other way around, exporting to >> some spreadsheet format, like gnumerica or scalc or xlsx. >> >> But that look equally difficult, isn't. >> >> Some hints would be welcome. >> > The big problem here is that there is no single format understood by all > these different programs which you can use. While CSV works OK for data, > it does not support formulas and other meta data. In particular, > translating formulas is a real challenge. > > I went down this rabbit hole some years back i.e. having a workflow > which allowed me to interact with others who used Excel and allowing me > to use org mode. > > It took hours and hours of additional work and never worked reliably > because > > - I never found a way of 'exporting' to a format which could be imported > by Excel and included formulas > > - None of the Excel export formats support full export of Excel - > especially at the meta data level i.e. Visual Basic macros and other > 'objects'. Workbooks were a real pain. > > - Constantly having to do 'hand tweaking' to fix formulas and other > 'meta' information (both directions). When exporting to Excel, I would > have to open the spreadsheet in another program to 'clean it up' > before sending it to colleagues. > > - Too many different Excel versions. This issue may not be as bad now, > but back then, there were multiple xlsx versions and you would get > different results depending on the version. > > In the end, I gave up and either just used LibreOffice (Linux) or an OSX > program (I think it was called numerics, but too long ago to recall > accurately - it was not an Apple program). In the end, my decision was > to only use org if either I only needed the data (possibly adding > formulas manually), would not need to export back to Excel (no > collaboration) and only need export to org once. Otherwise, use > LibreOffice or another program able to understand xlsx natively. > > One thing which we did use for a time was to connect the excel > spreadsheets with a database. The excel spreadsheet would pull the data > from the database and apply formulas/macros to that data. I was then > able to pull data from the database into org and then export it back > into the database. It took a bit to setup - used Visual Basic to manage > data import/export into database and needed an Excel based UI to do some > CRUD operations and then some scripts on the Linux side to > extract/update the data from org. This sort of worked, but had issues > with synchronisation of data. It really needed a much more sophisticated > database API to make it work well which could handle versioning or > resolve data conflicts and dependencies etc. > > To some extent, I guess Excel is a good example of what RMS was > concerned about and the problem with closed proprietary standards. While > someone can reverse engineer the formats and spend the time to develop > converters, they remain at the mercy of MS who can simply change the > formatting at their whim. Most efforts I've seen seem to run out of > puff because of the efforts needed to maintain things. > > Of course, life would probably be better if so many project managers > stopped using Excel for EVERYTHING! I've noticed over the last 10+ years > a growing use of Excel in the 'enterprise' as the default 'tool' to > collect and manage information. To many, it seems like a simple > solution, but in reality, you end up with all sorts of valuable > information floating around in multiple spreadsheets and spend far too > much time entering/updating data using a crappy interface and tweaking > format commands. I've seen more than one project almost hit the rocks > because someone was working off an old excel spreadsheet with the wrong > data. If you raise this concern, the likely outcome is a decision to use > MS Project, then your really stuffed! > > >